Buying a Z3M

[Medskipper]

I notice that one has cruise control. It's quite rare to see that on an S50 as it is electro-mechanical and not an easy retro-fit. S54 cruise control is just plug'n'play.

Thanks Pingo,
I just found this;
Although the UK-spec S50 motor was replaced in 2001 by the marginally more powerful S54 unit, there was very little difference between the two in terms of performance. The S50 M Roadster did the 0-60mph dash in 5.4sec (compared to 5.3 for the S54) and charged on to a governed top speed of 155mph. Its peak power was produced at a spinetingling 7400rpm.

 

[Mark Gutteridge]

I must be lucky having cruise control on my s50 then.

 

[Grumps]

I don't own an ///M but surely the easiest thing to do is to put the last 7 digits into the BMW archives website and it will tell you exactly what it is and if it left the factory with cruise etc.

 

[Ianmc]

There are significant differences in the S50 and S54 engines; technical comparison will illuminate. Having owned both (and driven a S54 for over 200K miles), I would definitely seek a S54 if tempted back. Worth noting that the S50 engined the E36 M3; the S54 the E46 M3. As with all these things, personal opinions will differ. Just don't buy a S50 for S54 money.

 

[Pingu]

There are significant differences in the S50 and S54 engines; technical comparison will illuminate. Having owned both (and driven a S54 for over 200K miles), I would definitely seek a S54 if tempted back. Worth noting that the S50 engined the E36 M3; the S54 the E46 M3. As with all these things, personal opinions will differ. Just don't buy a S50 for S54 money.

The greatest advantage with an S54 to me would be that I could "CSL it" with bolt on parts .

The S54 is more advanced (10 years of development ahead on the curve). It has pre and post cat lambda sensing, so the emissions are better controlled, for instance. It has fly-by-wire throttle (which can be programmed with a bit of knowledge). It has an ungraded VANOS which eliminated the weaknesses of the S50 VANOS - unfortunately, it introduced some of its own. It has a different cylinder head, but I don't think much of significance changed. Most of the improvements are in the ECUs.

For the same money, I would go for an S54. It's up to the buyer how much extra an S54 is worth.

If you do get an S54, just make sure that you use the correct engine oil (Castrol 10W/60). The VANOS oil pump tolerances are tighter.

With either car, it is vitally important to warm the oil before giving it the beans. The VANOS needs clean, thin oil to operate. The ports are very small and the pressures are very high (1400psi has been quoted).

Have fun shopping - and don't forget that it was a £40,000 car when new, so it comes with maintenance bills that you would expect with a £40,000 car.

 

[NeRo]

Worth noting that the S50 engined the E36 M3; the S54 the E46 M3.

IIRC, didn't the S54 have problems with bearing shells when new?

Did the S54 have DSC whereas the S50 didn't?

 

[Ianmc]

IIRC, didn't the S54 have problems with bearing shells when new?

Did the S54 have DSC whereas the S50 didn't?

There was a oil pump recall in the USA for the S54; as part of the recall bearing shells were replaced. The shells were a potential consequence rather than the cause. My S54 had circa 240K miles when sold; no pump or shell issues in that time.
Yes the S54 had DSC; saved my bacon a few times over the years!

 

[Pingu]

I wasn't aware of the S54 having DSC. Another reason to have it over the S50, but only because you have the option to it off.

 

[Medskipper]

There are significant differences in the S50 and S54 engines; technical comparison will illuminate. Having owned both (and driven a S54 for over 200K miles), I would definitely seek a S54 if tempted back. Worth noting that the S50 engined the E36 M3; the S54 the E46 M3. As with all these things, personal opinions will differ. Just don't buy a S50 for S54 money.

Very good point! I suppose the million dollar question is; if there is say a twenty year old Z3M with a S54 engine what would the difference in price be? Let’s say two cars both in very reasonable condition similar mileage but one with the S54 engine and the other with the S50 engine what do the highly knowledgeable people hear think the difference in price would be?
£10-15k for the S50 and 15-25k for the S54 ball park figures I know but just looking for a comparison? Don’t forget I’m talking U.K. prices.

Barry

 

[Pingu]

I wouldn't be surprised to see £5k difference for identical cars in all other ways. It used to be the case that some dealers didn't know what they had (especially as they are not in the book), but most now seem to know the score.

Personally (IMO), £5k is too big a difference for the improvement, but it is what it is.

You want to find someone who has seen a similar car for sale for £18k (an overpriced S50) and thinks he can get £18k for his car (an underpriced S54) . Don't forget to knock him down a bit, as well .

I think they have ceiling'd in price and will probably start to drop. The classic car mags that I read in the library when the missus is doing the shopping certainly think so.

Do you want to take the hit on a £20k car or a £15k car?

 

[Lazzzydog]

As with all things you generally get what you pay for in this life. Next month we are going to Italy in our Z3M and then doing Nodzeds Autumn Colours run. After that we may be selling it and the buyers with pound notes will decide what it’s worth.

 

[bp;ptxus]

Is the S54 a better engine than the S50 then?
Pros and cons?

S54 is the one that was in the M3 saloon - better performance, not many made, some other upgrades to suit the more powerful engine

 

[petecossie]

These details below are for the Z3 M Roadster models taken from the M Registry. The site has loads of info/history on all the M Models if anyone is interested just go to FAQ section to get list of models. So not many RHD S54 roadster made - 73 all told.

Production Versions
CK91: European-spec S50 B32 (LHD), 09/96 through 06/00
CK92: European-spec S50 B32 (RHD), 11/97 through 06/00
CK93: North American-spec S52 B32 (LHD), 02/98 through 07/00
CL91: European-spec S54 (LHD), 02/01 through 05/02
CL92: European-spec S54 (RHD), 02/01 through 04/02
CL93: North American-spec S54 (LHD), 02/01 through 05/02

History

What makes the E36/7 M roadster unique?
The M roadster is the BMW M-developed version of the Z3 roadster. It uses one of three 24-valve six-cylinder engines originally developed by BMW M for the E36 M3 and E46 M3. It also has an M-tuned chassis and several unique cosmetic parts.

Where was the E36/7 M roadster first introduced?
The M roadster was first unveiled at the 1996 Geneva motor show, though production did not begin until later that year.

Where was the E36/7 M roadster built?
Like all Z3-based cars, every M roadster was assembled at the Spartanburg, South Carolina factory. The drivetrain was assembled in Germany and mated with the rest of the car at Spartanburg.

Production Data

How many versions of the E36/7 M roadster were developed?
The original M roadsters, with engines from the E36 M3, were built through June of 2000 in three different versions: European-specification (S50 engine) in both left- and right-hand drive, and North American-specification (S52 engine) in left-hand drive.

After having been discontinued for more than six months, a revised M roadster entered production in February of 2001. All three versions (European-spec/LHD, European-spec/RHD and North American-spec) utilize the S54 motor from the E46 M3.

How many of each version were produced?
CK91 (ECE-spec S50, LHD): 3,557 produced from 09/96 through 06/2000
CK92, (ECE-spec (S50, RHD): 918 produced from 11/97 through 06/2000
CK93 (NA-spec S52, LHD): 8,938 produced from 02/98 through 07/2000
CL91 (ECE-spec S54, LHD): 271 produced from 02/2001 through 05/2002
CL92 (ECE-spec S54, RHD): 73 produced from 02/2001 through 04/2002
CL93 (NA-spec S54, LHD): 1,565 produced from 02/2001 through 05/2002

 

[Nodzed]

I must be lucky having cruise control on my s50 then.

Me too

 

[Nodzed]

The S54s command a premium price over the S50 and other than the rarity of the S54 in RHD spec I cant see the justification personally. Do you need DSC? I don't think so, in a car that would not now be a daily driver and spend most winter/wet days tucked up in the garage, if you have good tyres on the S50, and the suspension is sorted and learn how to drive it (and respect it especially in the wet) it wont catch you out too often, the traction is amazing even when pushed. Just my opinion.

 

[Ianmc]

S54 is the one that was in the M3 saloon

Yes in the E46 M3. The E36 M3 had the S50 engine.

 

[S54addict]

I didn't even know an S50 was a thing.....

 

[Medskipper]

Anybody got a picture of their S54 engine?

Fantastic amount of info from you guys, many thanks for all who contributed its very much appreciated!

Barry

 

[Nodzed]

I didn't even know an S50 was a thing.....

Just look to the left of the Beetle, that fantastic blue car, thats your S50

 

[Mario]

Any difference I the type of differential? I know the non Ms come with a clutch type diff for pre facelift and torsen for the facelift is it the same for the Ms S50 vs S54? I reckon the DSC would give me a bit more confidence when pushing the M to the limit you never know when you gonna find a bit of gravel half way through a tight bend