EVs - Discuss!
- Thread starter Redline
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I know zero about EV's but an interesting read.
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- Apr 1, 2016
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- Maybole , South Ayrshire
- Model of Z
- Z3 Individual Dakar / Orinoco Individual
That is no longer the case as of 1st September rules changed on Ev vansThe bonkers thing about those Steve, is no MoT, either
- Joined
- Apr 1, 2016
- Points
- 208
- Location
- Maybole , South Ayrshire
- Model of Z
- Z3 Individual Dakar / Orinoco Individual
That now means all full Ev and Hybrid passenger car and light commercial ( basically everything that is class 4) now required to have mot test ( no emmisions test still on these types of vehicles.
Stephen.
Stephen.
Expected that loop hole to be closed, didn't realise it had. Reverts back to the days of the old milkfloats
Milk Float?Expected that loop hole to be closed, didn't realise it had. Reverts back to the days of the old milkfloats
- Joined
- Dec 8, 2011
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- 145
How many pennies per mile?
- Joined
- Dec 8, 2011
- Points
- 145
Just change your name from Redline to Ernie. Everyone will know what you meanMilk Float?
.
Got to work it out accurately but around or less 3ppm estimate on electric based on 7kW charge at 7.25p/kWhr
Have a power meter on the mains just to check, but, I jumped in the shower before looking at the overnight electricity cost.
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- Dec 8, 2011
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but it's already 9ppm just in petrol (at £1.26/litre)
£1.32L around here.
If you just look at 3ppm compared to 9ppm is doesn’t seem much.
Conversely 9ppm is 300% more for those miles on electric.
The higher proportion of our routine journeys are now at 3ppm mile. The savings are from the aggregated miles. Pence soon builds in to pounds.
Even if you’re doing some long distance trips that bit of the journey on electric helps, especially where it is below 40mph or in slow traffic and most effective for electric.
When you factor in your journey profile over a long period the savings should start mounting. Moving over from a big thirsty car (as I have) it amounts to several holidays per year.
If you look at point price it doesn’t add up. Do the maths over full life cycle you get a different picture entirely, especially if your usage suits the technology. That’s the key.
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- Dec 8, 2011
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- 145
We are trying to sing from the same song sheet, but the sounds are different
.In reality, I think that it is too early to tell. Compared to your old Disco, I suspect that you will probably not make much of a saving over one year. I suspect that you will save if you keep for longer.
You need to fill the petrol tank, go home and fill the batteries, run it for a week or so and do the same again, obviously keeping a log of all the fuel and leccy that you put in the car. That is the only way that you will know what the real cost per mile will be.
I doubt if your Disco would lose £5k in a year (dependent on age, you may not have lost anything), but you may save £5k in a year on fuel. That will mean that you have broken even, then year 2 will be profit.
I'd love to join the EV crowd, but until an EV is nearer the bottom of the depreciation curve (<£500 loss per year) AND the reliability is proven AND the range is >150 miles - A'm oot (unfortunately)
. My van is 13ppm with a 500 mile range and only cost £1000 - it won't be worth much less as long as it has an MOT. I've lost about £7k in 4 years on my Smart and it costs 10ppm - most people think it's a cheap car, but I think it's expensive - who wants to set fire to £2,000 every year?. EVs have a lot of cheap competition and I can't afford the depreciation losses.
I like the way there is a lot less vitriol against electric cars than a few years ago lol .if you mentioned electric even on here ,there was so much hate and rumours that anything that didn’t make smoke was treated as the work of the devil. How quickly technology advances it’s difficult to keep up like my phone,who would of imagined,it’s crazy most people are so short sighted do you ever think what the world will be like in 10 years 50 years or 100 we won’t be a little country on our own that’s for sure and fossil fuel won’t be powering our mode of transport.For our grandchildren we need to make the right choices now and be in on the decisions that will affect their lives.
I understand what you’re say - sorry if it sounded at crossed purposes.We are trying to sing from the same song sheet, but the sounds are different
In reality, I think that it is too early to tell. Compared to your old Disco, I suspect that you will probably not make much of a saving over one year. I suspect that you will save if you keep for longer.
You need to fill the petrol tank, go home and fill the batteries, run it for a week or so and do the same again, obviously keeping a log of all the fuel and leccy that you put in the car. That is the only way that you will know what the real cost per mile will be.
I doubt if your Disco would lose £5k in a year (dependent on age, you may not have lost anything), but you may save £5k in a year on fuel. That will mean that you have broken even, then year 2 will be profit.
I'd love to join the EV crowd, but until an EV is nearer the bottom of the depreciation curve (<£500 loss per year) AND the reliability is proven AND the range is >150 miles - A'm oot (unfortunately)
Depreciation is always the hidden cost. You can’t get around it. All cars are the same to one degree or another. Part of the joys of ownership. Something you can’t circumvent, only decide what’s acceptable to you.
Certainly we could have bought a much older jalopy but depreciation is often replaced by other costs and increased unreliability.
We all have to consider what we want our cars to do. A completely reliable car is essential. Elderly parents who live a distance away mean a journey any time day or night is possible. As is carrying four people even if only a fraction of the time but sometimes over 100s of miles.
What I wouldn’t do it buy new and take that massive hit.
Going hybrid is just part of the mix in the cauldron of decisions you have to navigate.
The purpose here is to look at the technology and costs and savings all other things being equal, and also to look at real world issues not the outrageous claims made by manufacturers.
Change is the only certainty Hugh. Either embrace it or become isolated and a dinosaur. .
The world has changed dramatically over the last 10 years. Transport is one area that while it has changed it’s not as great as other areas of our lives. The last few years have seen a quickening of the pace though.
Hybrid and current all electric (in it’s current form)
is only a stepping stone to the future. It will be gone in 10 years. If you don’t push the boundaries you don’t make progress.
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- Dec 8, 2011
- Points
- 145
I look at EV v ICE in the same way as someone in 1914 would have looked at Horses v ICE, and I can see it going the same way.
Those who saw horses as just a form of transport looked at the internal combustion engine as the next iteration of transport. Those who saw a horse as a friend kept their horse - seem familiar?
I want to keep my horse in a stable for Sundays to go from A-A, and use this new fangled automobile thingy for work and A-B journeys.
I can't wait for the justification to go electric
Those who saw horses as just a form of transport looked at the internal combustion engine as the next iteration of transport. Those who saw a horse as a friend kept their horse - seem familiar?
I want to keep my horse in a stable for Sundays to go from A-A, and use this new fangled automobile thingy for work and A-B journeys
.I can't wait for the justification to go electric
That’s the way I look at it.I look at EV v ICE in the same way as someone in 1914 would have looked at Horses v ICE, and I can see it going the same way.
Those who saw horses as just a form of transport looked at the internal combustion engine as the next iteration of transport. Those who saw a horse as a friend kept their horse - seem familiar?
I want to keep my horse in a stable for Sundays to go from A-A, and use this new fangled automobile thingy for work and A-B journeys
I can't wait for the justification to go electric
The daily driver is there to do a job. It’s a tool come the end of the day. It has to work for its living.
I would really loved to have gone fully EV, but, the compromises and limitations were just too big to overcome.
One of my points is that the big benefits handed out are given to corporations and on to company car drivers.
Poor old Joe Bloggs who are stuck with diesel that government has turned from hero to villain can’t access those benefits nor can they afford to change. It’s a poverty trap. Many, like yourself would love to or are desperate to change.
We’re very lucky that our circumstances have changed and provided the opportunity and need to change - but, it still has its costs that have to pay back in some way.
Found this on Bimmerfest. Shows how the drive train works.
https://www.bimmerfest.com/news/898889/bmw-plugin-hybrid-330e-technical-details/
The electric motor is integral with the ZF auto box and does have a clutch between the output shaft of the ICE and gearbox.
Engineering wise this makes great sense. All the torque is injected directly on the drive train without any extra gears.
I guess the engine is started simply by closing the clutch enough to spin it up and match shaft speeds before fully closing.
Is there a standard starter motor too? Even putting the car into Save mode, the battery is used to move the car before the ICE kicks in to life.
There is a standard 12V battery under there somewhere - I guess it must do something!
https://www.bimmerfest.com/news/898889/bmw-plugin-hybrid-330e-technical-details/
The electric motor is integral with the ZF auto box and does have a clutch between the output shaft of the ICE and gearbox.
Engineering wise this makes great sense. All the torque is injected directly on the drive train without any extra gears.
I guess the engine is started simply by closing the clutch enough to spin it up and match shaft speeds before fully closing.
Is there a standard starter motor too? Even putting the car into Save mode, the battery is used to move the car before the ICE kicks in to life.
There is a standard 12V battery under there somewhere - I guess it must do something!