Engine Rattle when Warming Up - Diagnosis? ?

[Alex Funnell]

I have finally got a good video

It makes the noise when warming up between the blue Square on the temp gauge and the first line then it goes away when warmed up. It also only does it between 1100 and 1600 rpm

 

[bessieblue]

could be water pump ? or timing chain

 

[Antm72]

As above is it the cam chain tensioner ? when you rev it fast enough you may get enough pressure in it to stop the chatter.

 

[oldcarman]

Time for the sounding stick to the ear. Here we use pieces of old hockey sticks but you could use old cricket bats, croquet mallets, broken horse jump fencing, cutoffs from @miller1098 bed projects, etc! JIM

 

[t-tony]

I'm confident that's the timing chain. I'm not sure but you may be able to change the hydraulic tensioner without major dismantling. You certainly could on some of the older BMW engines but I can't say for sure on these "newer" ones. The only problem being is that the chain itself may be worn and also the guide/slides inside the timing case too.

Tony.

ps. We have an Autodata book on timing chains at work so I will have a look in the morning.

 

[Redline]

try valve life cleaner its poss one or more of your valve lifter sticking not getting filled with oil, this will clean them out when ready for next oil change put some cleaner in before you change the oil this works for a lot of cars

Fabulous though my 3.0L si is, it too has started to make a distinct tapping noise after start-up (which wasn't there when I bought it just two months ago). It continues until the car is well warm (well dramatically reduces) and had a good run and given a few revs. I suspect this because it isn't being used daily other than moving off the drive to swap cars around that that is contributing to the problem. It has been used on a couple of 25+ mile journeys to work but only a couple of days per week.

I've not yet done the large screwdriver diagnosis but expect it to be the Hydraulic Valve lifter on one of the valves.

I've read lots of threads indicating that some are distinctly concerned about this noise and then others less so. Noise like this does indicate a problem to me (Noise = wear) so I'd rather be without it. What is a little concerning is that it doesn't go away within 30-45 seconds as some suggest it should. I've also seen quotes that suggest BMW rev the engine to 2.5k revs for 2 minutes. If it continues then it might be a problem. I've not yet done this but will give to a go when the engine is nice and hot.

So, three questions :-

How far in advance of the oil change do you use this oil supplement to alleviate the problem?
I've read that using a 0W oil instead of the recommended 5W will help. Anybody agree?
Is it such a serious problem that, if it continues, it requires the newer lifters with non-return valve or even new head? Is any serious damage going to result from noisy HVLs?

Oops thats 4 questions....

 

[t-tony]

Hi Ian, my 2.0 had a slight tap from cold when I first bought it.. I put in some Wynns Hydraulic valve lifter concentrate, you leave it in with the oil permanently. After then next oil change I used it again but the next one I used just normal engine oil and the tapping has never returned, Roy @Rha has commented on how quiet my Z3 runs. It costs around £15 a tin, I really rate their products.

Tony.

 

[Redline]

Hi Ian, my 2.0 had a slight tap from cold when I first bought it.. I put in some Wynns Hydraulic valve lifter concentrate, you leave it in with the oil permanently. After then next oil change I used it again but the next one I used just normal engine oil and the tapping has never returned, Roy @Rha has commented on how quiet my Z3 runs. It costs around £15 a tin, I really rate their products.

Tony.

Thanks Tony - I'll give it a try

 

[Rha]

Hi Ian, my 2.0 had a slight tap from cold when I first bought it.. I put in some Wynns Hydraulic valve lifter concentrate, you leave it in with the oil permanently. After then next oil change I used it again but the next one I used just normal engine oil and the tapping has never returned, Roy @Rha has commented on how quiet my Z3 runs. It costs around £15 a tin, I really rate their products.

Tony.

Yep, I really was impressed at how quiet your engine was Tony, oh by the way I've just failed my annual hearing test.

But never the less have decided to use Wynns in my next oil change.

 

[t-tony]

Royston, you came very close to joining a very exclusive club there my friend.

Tony.

 

[oldcarman]

Yep, I really was impressed at how quiet your engine was Tony, oh by the way I've just failed my annual hearing test.

But never the less have decided to use Wynns in my next oil change.

A bit in each ear may help there also @Rha!! JIM

 

[t-tony]

A bit in each ear may

Cheeky monkey will have a ringing in the ear.

Tony.

 

[Rha]

Oh oh, something I said,???????????

 

[t-tony]

Ha,Ha,

Tony.

 

[Alex Funnell]

It doesn't look too bad. I have primary tensioner out de greasing. I may get some of that Wynn valve lifter treatment too. Anyone know what that actually does to the oil?

 

[Antm72]

I imagine it is just a treatment that cleans out the deposits in the oil ways so that the oil can pass into them cleanly making sure they work correctly.
Used to use a similar thing in the day on my ford cvh engines and it removed rattle in them from the lifters.

 

[Redline]

It doesn't look too bad. I have primary tensioner out de greasing. I may get some of that Wynn valve lifter treatment too. Anyone know what that actually does to the oil?

Just bought some from Halfords (but not put it in yet).

I'll let you know if there's any magic improvement.

 

[Redline]

Hi Ian, my 2.0 had a slight tap from cold when I first bought it.. I put in some Wynns Hydraulic valve lifter concentrate, you leave it in with the oil permanently. After then next oil change I used it again but the next one I used just normal engine oil and the tapping has never returned, Roy @Rha has commented on how quiet my Z3 runs. It costs around £15 a tin, I really rate their products.

Tony.

They sell it at Halfords in 350ml bottles (enough for 3-6L of oil they state). I hope its the same stuff as in a 'tin' as you suggest cos I just bought some.

I just went to move my Zed, and, after being run for a couple of miles yesterday evening and still making a little bit of noise (but nothing like it did when cold) and then being stood overnight in below zero conditions, it just started now without any ticking noise whatsoever.

Am pretty sure its the Hydraulic Valve Lifters draining over a few days of little or no use and not recharging quickly when first restarted. I guess the cold overnight temperature was sufficient to thicken the oil up before it had chance to drain. Will see if the treatment clears out any gunk to help the oil flow. Next decision will be which oil to use on the next service.

 

[One Spanner Frank]

From someone with no knowledge of the car or mechanics, it sounds like something is in contact with a chain. If it clears when warm, could a tensioner be easing with heat or lubrication?

 

[smiffy]

buy a stethoscope

http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=m570.l1313&_nkw=mechanics+stethoscope+&_sacat=0