Look for yourself.....Is it my imagination?...........

FRANKIE

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American Zeds
The M44 Massive
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Sep 2, 2013
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193
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Egg Harbor Township, New Jersey, USA
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Z3
As many of you know, @miller1098 and I were on a cross country trip (USA) a year and a half ago. I had bought a car in California and drove it east to New Jersey. When we first saw the car in San Diego, one of the things we checked was the condition of the tires. The rear tires are, as you know, are very wide. Upon looking at them, we noticed a lot of tread on the part of the tire that we could see and gave it little thought to check the inside edge of the tread. As it turns out, the inside part of the tire was almost bald, while the outside had loads of tread. We ended up with a flat in West Virginia and had to have both tires replaced. Upon speaking to a 35 year BMW mechanic, he told me that it was a big complaint about the ///M that the tire was set to angle inward on purpose to give better results for particular types of driving. As a result, the rear tires rarely got more that 20,000 miles.
I recently posted 3 pictures of the ///M in "Show us your best Zed photo". I was just looking at them again and while I had seen these pictures many many times, for the first time, believed I noticed something else for the first time. Is it my imagination, or can you ACTUALLY SEE the leaning inward of the rear tire in this picture?

 

Brian H

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E36/7 3.0i - E85 Z4///M
The rear camber is a well know issue on Z3s @FRANKIE , more so on standard Z3s than on ///Ms, it is not adjustable either unless you put camber plates on or eccentric bushes in the rear swing arms.
 

Antm72

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Its common on a Zed Frankie the lower the car the more its visable.
Mines the same doesn't look bad think its photo angle making it look worse than it is.
 

t-tony

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#ZedShed
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Spacers fitted on the rear tend to accentuate it too.

Tony.
 

DavidM

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New tyres will help rectify camber - then swap rear tyres every 5000 miles - keeps the angle minimum until next tyre change?
 

Brian H

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New tyres will help rectify camber - then swap rear tyres every 5000 miles - keeps the angle minimum until next tyre change?
New tyres will not help rectify the camber, all you are doing here is managing your tyres (i.e. wear on the inner edge), which is a good idea. The only way to rectify the camber is to mechanically adjust the trailing arms with the methods described in post 2.
 

Gundun

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Belgian Zeds
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West Flanders
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2.2i Sport Line Individual
This is why I am still very hesitant with lowered springs: back in the days I had a pal with a 2.8 which he wanted ridiculously low, he totally ruined a nearly brand new set of Yokohama rubbers in a few miles.

If I'll ever lower mine I'll also spare a few bucks more and put on camber plates...

...and yes, I also think the rear wheel in your picture is leaning inwards, same as all the Z3's...
 
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DavidM

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New tyres will not help rectify the camber, all you are doing here is managing your tyres (i.e. wear on the inner edge), which is a good idea. The only way to rectify the camber is to mechanically adjust the trailing arms with the methods described in post 2.
Yes - totally agree. I should have been more specific in my thread. Cosmetically - new tyres will negate camber up to a point - and for a time - the length of time dependent on how hard the car is driven and also - how often the rear tyres are interchanged to help even wear on inner treads. I put a new set of tyres on my Zito alloys - now reading 4,000 miles since changeover - and I have yet to do a swap on the rears - just can't recall the tyre make. I don't drive the car hard though - but keep a watchful eye on the rear inner tread. I should say the car is lowered - and had excessive camber on badly worn tyres - now it has slight camber on good tyres - which looks fine - for a time.
 

mwpe

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It is a common problem with the old E30 type suspension but some cars are worse than others. My old E30 used to eat rear tyres all the time I owned it which was for 18,000 miles. It did vary with make, on Goodyears, it was very bad but I once fitted a set of cheap Hankooks and got over 20,00 on them. Funnily enough, My zed with 245/40/17's doesn't suffer from it at all.
 

Zeti

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Romanian Zeds
The M44 Massive
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Z3 roadster 1.9
Lower suspension is dramatically increasing the rear camber. See my car, same photocamera, before and after coming back to the factory level:
P1190357.JPG

View attachment 46311
P1220699.JPG
 
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FRANKIE

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American Zeds
The M44 Massive
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Sep 2, 2013
Points
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Egg Harbor Township, New Jersey, USA
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Z3
New tyres will help rectify camber - then swap rear tyres every 5000 miles - keeps the angle minimum until next tyre change?
Not quite sure what you're saying about 'swap tires'. Frankie
Lower suspension is dramatically increasing the rear camber. See my car, same photocamera, before and after coming back to the factory level:
View attachment 46310
View attachment 46311
View attachment 46312
Looks like some nice country to drive through!! Almost like Wales........ Frankie
 

oldcarman

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Canadian Zeds
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Pine Falls Manitoba can.
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I believe @DavidM is suggesting swapping the tire right to left left to right by removing from the rims. This puts newer rubber on the inner which in turn wears down the inner tire eventually to the same as the outer. Extends the tires milage a bit and I think a good idea. Hope that makes sense @FRANKIE!! JIM
 

DavidM

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Thank you, Jim - concisely put!:)
 

mwpe

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I believe @DavidM is suggesting swapping the tire right to left left to right by removing from the rims. This puts newer rubber on the inner which in turn wears down the inner tire eventually to the same as the outer. Extends the tires milage a bit and I think a good idea. Hope that makes sense @FRANKIE!! JIM
I used to do that on my E30, it nearly doubled tyre life.
 

FRANKIE

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American Zeds
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Egg Harbor Township, New Jersey, USA
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Z3
I believe @DavidM is suggesting swapping the tire right to left left to right by removing from the rims. This puts newer rubber on the inner which in turn wears down the inner tire eventually to the same as the outer. Extends the tires milage a bit and I think a good idea. Hope that makes sense @FRANKIE!! JIM
I thought that was what you meant and I have the capacity to do that easily as I have a coats 10-10 tire machine I bought from a farmer who had sold out to a developer and was liquidating his property. It works great. I used to go to junkyards and look into recently arrived autos that had new tires in the trunks as spares and buy them for $10. then use the machine to change them to my rims. Frankie
 

oldcarman

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That sure would be a handy thing to have access to @ FRANKIE. I used to use the one at my friends cycle shop until he passed away. I couldn't stand the guy that has it now but have a great neighbour that runs a service shop next property to mine so easy to accomplish now but at a reasonable cost. I find myself doing as so many others do and that is we know in our minds where we're going with thoughts and really miss out on some major pieces in the post which leaves people scratching their heads. But we all try best we can!! JIM
 

FRANKIE

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American Zeds
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Points
193
Location
Egg Harbor Township, New Jersey, USA
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Z3
That sure would be a handy thing to have access to @ FRANKIE. I used to use the one at my friends cycle shop until he passed away. I couldn't stand the guy that has it now but have a great neighbour that runs a service shop next property to mine so easy to accomplish now but at a reasonable cost. I find myself doing as so many others do and that is we know in our minds where we're going with thoughts and really miss out on some major pieces in the post which leaves people scratching their heads. But we all try best we can!! JIM
Many years ago I really missed out on some great deals. There was a Sears located at the Shore Mall about a mile away on the Black Horse Pike that was relocating to the Hamilton Mall about 6 miles away, which was just finished being built. An auction company from Macon, Georgia was auctioning off everything in the store. All the merchandise was already transferred to the new store but everything else was being sold. I picked up a lot of things such as a vacuum pump, compressor for a refrigerator, coat racks, file cabinets, and many other small things. But they had a unit in the cafeteria that was stainless steel with 2 doors for refrigeration and one door for a freezer. The unit had 2 separate compressors. It was made by Gemco out of Philadelphia. A new 3 door unit like that sold for about $4000.00. I figured used it should go for at least $1800.00. It was one of the last things they were auctioning off. They had walked through the entire building auctioning things as they came upon them and now we were in the cafeteria but after a long day, instead of the 1 or 2 hundred people that started in the morning, there were only about 10 of us left. I could have used something like that in the basement for extra things I had to refrigerate or freeze. If I was lucky, I'd get it for 8 or 9 hundred. They started the bidding off at a high price but no one bid. So they finally started at $50.00 and there was one bid. The auctioneer asked for $70.00 and I raised my hand. He asked for $90.00. No one bid so he sold it to me for $70.00. It took a few minutes for it to sink in. They had to remove a section of wall to get it out of the kitchen. I had no way to get it home. I called a friend with a small pick up and took it home with that. I had a separate door on the outside for the basement and spent half the next day arriving at the conclusion that there was no way I could get it into the house. I put it into the paper and sold it for $1100.00. They had an automotive building at Sears where they auctioned off all the equipment the day before. Hardly anyone knew about it and only a handful of people showed up. They auctioned off tire changers and high speed tire balancing machines worth over $3000.00 for $95.00 to $105.00. I really missed out there. The tire balancers were the type where you placed the tire on a spindle and lowered a protective cover over the tire. You turned it on and it spun the tire at high speeds. When it finished and the tire stopped, you could slowly rotate the tire by hand. As you passed a marker on the machine, a display would light up with the amount of weight needed at that point of the rim to balance the tire. All for $105.00. Frankie

PS. After buying the 3 door refrigerator, I had noticed a large floor freezer that they missed. All the bidders had gone and I asked the auctioneer what he was going to do with the freezer. He told me if I wanted it, I could have it. When removing it, a Sears employee told me that they had just put a new compressor in it and it froze popsicles so cold that if they dropped one on the floor, it shattered. I gave it to a friend of mine who had a restaurant.
 
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oldcarman

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Pine Falls Manitoba can.
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The ones that get away come back to haunt us @FRANKIE! I've missed out on similar deals although at the time I didn't have anywhere to put the stuff. Now I have 1500+sq ft of shop I can't find those deals now I need them!! JIM
PS, but I do have a commercial ice machine and a beer tap system complete!! lol.
 

Zeti

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Romanian Zeds
The M44 Massive
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Bucuresti/ Romania
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Z3 roadster 1.9
One of the Murphy's laws: "if you finally decided to throw away some things, you will need it the second day you done it!"
Works for me all the time...
 
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