led headlights

t-tony

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I'm fairly sure that as long as it gives the correct beam pattern to enable headlight aim to be tested most testers will not check the brightness. At the present time this is something being looked into by the DVSA.

Tony.
 

ppavuk

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I'm fairly sure that as long as it gives the correct beam pattern to enable headlight aim to be tested most testers will not check the brightness. At the present time this is something being looked into by the DVSA.

Tony.
So, basically at the moment it is not prohibited nor allowed? Kind of grey zone? I know aftermarket xenon lights a often bad for other drivers. If those led not of this kind i'd perhaps try them.
 

Redline

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I thought that because it's a change to any possible options from the manufacturer that it's is deemed non standard so has a risk of failing the mot. It seems to be an inconsistent mess.
As far as headlights are concerned I've seen lots of discussion on the designs. The LEDs don't illuminate from the same position as the filament in a halogen bulb. The same goes for HIDs. As a consequence the beam pattern is somewhat disrupted and inconsistent.
 

t-tony

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These are from the same maker as my front DRL's. I will make some enquiries and see what I can find out.

Tony.
 

5harp3y

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All depends on their ability to use the original reflectors.

I've been looking into these but they are way too expensive to be viable for me
 

Redline

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This is the engineer in me thinking about the issues in a little more depth. I had a good look at replacing my halogens that have the intensity of oxygen starved candles with both H7 replacement HIDs and LEDs - I concluded that more than just the bulbs will be required. I thought I would share how I got to this conclusion. You will probably find it boring and/or incomprehensible but hopefully it might help.

LEDs can now easily produce a more intense light and at a specific colour using less power than existing halogen bulbs. There are however design and semi-conductor issues to consider in their application in specific existing scenarios. I fear these bulbs are created to get people to buy them simply because they are LEDs. They are not necessarily better and may in fact be considerably worse.

Fundamentally, LEDs, halogens and HIDs all work using the same electronic phenomena at the quantum physics level. Halogens and other filament bulbs use heat to excite electrons. HIDs use gas discharge and LEDs use semi-conductors. It is the electrons falling energy levels within atoms that cause light to be created. LEDs are far more energy efficient in doing this hence their increasingly wide usage. At that point LEDs seem to be the favourite to use.

Back to my earlier post. The existing reflectors (an projectors if you have them) will be designed around a standard H7 bulb or similar. The filament runs down the centre of the bulb and within very tight tolerances.
The reflector will be designed such that the reflection of light is designed around that very tightly toleranced column from which the light is created.

HID replacement for Halogens and also these LEDs have the same physical issues when used in a reflector designed for halogen use. The light from both gas discharge and LEDs is created at a different physical way and is more distributed in a completely differently pattern even though it might only fe a few millimetres difference. The reflector designed specifically for the mechanics of an H7 type bulb simply cannot gather and reflect the light to the same pattern from this distributed source.

These LEDs are probably worse in that the light creation is all along one plane and not in 360 degrees. Half your reflector cannot be used so the light pattern in your existing reflector will be completely wrong and potentially severely degraded.

The second issue is specifically on high intensity LEDs. They do run quite hot compared to your standard LED (if you have an LED TV it still feels warm). The high intensity LEDs create a considerable amount of heat. However, heat itself causes them to become less efficient - its a simple quantum mechanics issue. You can see the back of the LED has heat dissipation built in. However, in sealed headlights, there is little opportunity to dissipate the heat. Its quite possible that when they have been on a while, they will become too hot and hence less bright. Not something you want when driving long distances on unlit motorways or country lanes.

If, however, you have an enclosure, reflector and projector lens specifically designed for this LED construction, I'm sure they will be close to as good if not better than H7 Halogens. As a direct replacement, I can't see how they can perform anywhere near as well.
I do hope though that someone can prove me wrong though.
 

ppavuk

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All depends on their ability to use the original reflectors.

I've been looking into these but they are way too expensive to be viable for me
The cost is around 60 quids, just 2 times comparing to an good Osram H7 set. Taking in account those will work 50000H compared to just 8000H lifetime of standard bulbs value seems to be very good. The question is it actually better that conventional bulbs. Some people suggests it not.
 

ppavuk

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got a set fom amazon, and sending it back. Despite stated as direct replacement for any h7 - does not fit e85. Same with Vauxhall - no luck. So dont buy this rubbish!
 

t-tony

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Cheers for the heads up Pete.

Tony.
 

Brian4

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As @Redline said above fitting of replacement bulbs other than of the same design as originals is very unlikely to work as the reflectors are designed for that type of bulb.and the position of the light source differs with each type so beam pattern changes.
HID headlamps have a large lens in front of the reflector to focus the light and a shield to create the dip beam.

LED headlamps consist of mirrors and other reflectors to produce the required beam pattern hence they are a 4 figure option where available.

Unfortunately we will have to stick with the same type of bulb for our original headlamps as they were fitted with ie halogen.
 

ppavuk

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As @Redline said above fitting of replacement bulbs other than of the same design as originals is very unlikely to work as the reflectors are designed for that type of bulb.and the position of the light source differs with each type so beam pattern changes.
HID headlamps have a large lens in front of the reflector to focus the light and a shield to create the dip beam.

LED headlamps consist of mirrors and other reflectors to produce the required beam pattern hence they are a 4 figure option where available.

Unfortunately we will have to stick with the same type of bulb for our original headlamps as they were fitted with ie halogen.
you are 100% correct. I am currently bidding on ebay for set of standard z4 headunits, and my plan is if i get these on right price I'll try to replace original dipped beam assembly with Hella bi-xenon lens. There is some of 80mm diameter, so could fit. For dipped beam on z4 reflector almost do nothing, it is separate assembly under the lens, main reflector is truly cosmetic feature, so this could work!
 

Stevo7682

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I have looked at these for my z3 main beam 9006 might work not bad as basically a spotlight so lense job collect/ project .
But the 9005 fitted to dip beam different as it has to focus the light onto the lense to create the beam pattern not sure the led would correctly do this.
 

John Thompson

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So, basically at the moment it is not prohibited nor allowed? Kind of grey zone? I know aftermarket xenon lights a often bad for other drivers. If those led not of this kind i'd perhaps try them.
You are not allowed to retrofit xenons without a headlamp washer, I fit xenons to a smart roadster I had and it failed the mot, so I jus got a pair of nozzles from a breaker in the colour (or as near as damn it) and just stuck them onto the bumper, however i did take it to a different mot station cos if i took it back to the original station he would have definitely have tried them, but it sailed through the next one, but just be aware xenons require a washer system as dirt on the outer glass lens amplifies any deflection of errant light
 

t-tony

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You are not allowed to retrofit xenons without a headlamp washer, I fit xenons to a smart roadster I had and it failed the mot, so I jus got a pair of nozzles from a breaker in the colour (or as near as damn it) and just stuck them onto the bumper, however i did take it to a different mot station cos if i took it back to the original station he would have definitely have tried them, but it sailed through the next one, but just be aware xenons require a washer system as dirt on the outer glass lens amplifies any deflection of errant light
Incorrect info John. Retro fitted xenon lights don't have to have washers.

Tony.
 

Nodzed

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Tried a set of LED Cree's in the M that my mate gave me after he tried them, absolutely rubbish! don't waste your money IMHO
 
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