Gearbox Removal

[Faheem]

So attempted a gearbox removal these weekend.

Sadly its off a Fiat 500, so nothing too exciting. Undoubtedly will be considerably easier than a RWD car as the box is lighter (although I do plan on replacing the clutch on my zed this summer).

Gearbox came out after 5 hours or so, the driveshafts were an absolute nightmare to remove from the gearbox end. Had to use a ball joint separator as I didn't have the correct tool for it.

Anyway. Reason I removed it was because I was getting a whining noise, the pitch also changed when I pressed the clutch down. So I suspected that the release bearing was bad.

When the box was finally free from the engine I noticed that the release bearing was stuck on the pressure plate. Part of it was on the fork inside the gearbox and the other half stuck to the pressure plate.

Was going to stick a new release bearing and get the old clutch disc relined. Not sure whether to use the old pressure plate at the moment!

 

[t-tony]

False economy Faheem. Replace the whole clutch, pressure plate, friction disc and release bearing mate. No point in not doing when the box is out.

Tony.

 

[Mazza]

Look forward to seeing your write up on replacing the Zed Clutch.

 

[Faheem]

Cheers Tony. Was thinking originally just to have the old disc relined and install the new release bearing but I'd only be saving a few quid by doing so. Might just bite the bullet and buy new.

 

[Faheem]

Anyone have any experience with transmech clutch kits (from ECP) or Borg & Beck? Not a whole lot on the internet about either. Transmech had some bad reviews but all of these are 10+ years old. The equivalent valeo kit or Luk are double the price.

 

[t-tony]

Borg and Beck used to be a reliable brand mate. Again don't go too cheap or you will be doing it again, possibly soon. If you're doing it to sell the car then that's a different thing.

Tony.

 

[Faheem]

The car will be up for sale once the gearbox is back in. Still like you say it is worth doing right so that its peace of mind for the next owner too.

 

[t-tony]

True enough. Also a selling point especially if you show what you spent on the parts mate.

Tony.

 

[Faheem]

So come across a slight problem....

The gearbox went back into the car and everything bolted up okay (alignment was a nightmare with a cheap eBay tool)

Got the car back together and noticed that the gear stick wasn't returning back to neutral - but I was able get into all of the gears (1-5 and reverse).

Realised that I hadn't attached the top gearbox linkage cable and bracket that controls gearstick L/R movement.

Attached the cable onto the car but now the gearstick sits all the way to the left and I cant get into 3, 5 or Reverse...

I tried adjusting the linkage cable by winding all the way in which should have taken it to the left a little bit but this didn't work?

Have I just missed something? Spent hours now and I'm convinced it's got to be something simple but can't work it out.

 

[t-tony]

I would disconnect the cables and make sure the gearbox is in neutral before reconnecting the cables. A bit late now, but, you should not take the levers off by removing the nuts, you should pop the cables off the ball pins then you wouldn't have the problem you now have. Also make sure the lever sits properly on the "flats" which are machined onto the shaft.

Tony.

 

[Faheem]

Cheers Tony. I agree re the ball pins, the bottom cable was pried from the ball pin it was only the top where I had removed the bracket - thinking it would be easier and there'd be less chance off damaging the bushing. (definitely shouldn't have in hindsight).

I did try and put the top cable in whilst the gearbox is in neutral but that just forces the gear stick all the way to the left and can't move the gear stick to the right once the cable is in.

The shaft at the top of the gearbox also has up/down movement? Can't see a reason why it would need to move up/down? Once the gear linkage bracket is on it isn't possible for the shaft to move up/down....

I'll probably have to head to a scrappy to see a 'working' example.

 

[t-tony]

The shaft that moves up and down (in and out) is the one which moves the "gate" between 1-2, 3-4 and 5-R. The other cable moves the selector from 1st to 2nd, 3rd to 4th and 5th to Rev.
Hope that makes sense. Is it possible the you're fitting the lever onto the selector shaft upside down?. That's the only reason I can think why you are having the problem that you are mate.

Tony.

 

[Faheem]

Ha ha, that was one of the first things that I tried, thinking that I had done a Sean and fitted it upside down

If I do flip the lever over the linkage cables just foul the gearbox.

Once I put the lever on and tighten the nut down, I can't move the shaft up and down as the nut that holds the lever will prevent the shaft from moving up/down.

I feel as though it's going to be something dead simple that I'm doing wrong or have overlooked!

 

[t-tony]

If I do flip the lever over the linkage cables just foul the gearbox.

Ok, so it is possible that your fitting the the lever onto the selector 180 deg. out? That would account for the gear lever being way over to one side. You'll need to reset the cable adjustment back to (as near as you can) the original position before trying anything else other wise you don't know if you have made an improvement or not.
Also it looks as though there are bits of metal surrounding the selector as though the lever is fouling on the alloy casting, is there something missing from between the lever and the casting? Like a spacer of some sort?

Tony.

 

[Faheem]

Hmmm... not sure if it could go 180 deg. out as that would foul on the slave cylinder.

I found this picture online which looks like it's the same gearbox just on a different Fiat (Panda I think)

Looking at the picture the gear selector looks like it's in a similar position - but maybe a tad to the left (which would make sense and is the position that I would expect my selector to be in)

Problem is that I can't get it anymore to the left as it 'locks' up after I've moved it a little bit.

I put this video together the other day just to look at it a bit closer shows what the linkages are like when I'm changing gear -

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hUc7hxGNTvY


I'll probably look at getting the selector off the car and making sure it's all okay. Think it's secured to the gearbox by 5 bolts.

The bushes on the linkage will need addressing but aren't the cause of my issue (I don't think)

 

[t-tony]

Hey mate, I just found this. Does this look like the same linkage? I think it could be.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EH3EU-mQVhg


Tony.

 

[t-tony]

Fiat 500.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_s-m8tjmuNM


Tony.

 

[t-tony]

This,

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s66bkAKNSns


Tony.

 

[Faheem]

Thanks, I'd watched the second video before removing the gearbox and followed it as closely as I could.

The first video definitely looks like it has the same linkage mechanism as mine so can definitely use that when removing it from the car (if it comes to that).

Will let you know how I get on.

 

[Delk]

Is it possible the cables are swapped?