electric cars why so exspensive?

california123

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With the arrival of electric cars i was wondering why are they so exspensive,surely they should be cheaper than their combustion engine counterparts?The car companies dont have to buy engines and exausts, and im sure countless other components.So if the car companies are saving on all these exspensive items, and stick a battery in the car instead to propel it,on the face of it ,it dosnt sound fair,but maybe you guys can exsplain.ps i wont be buying an electric car ever,hopefully.Bring back the v12 engines with that glorious sound!!!!!!!
 

Pingu

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A battery pack is about the price of an engine and the motor is around 2/3 the price of that.

Economies of scale haven't really kicked in yet. Production numbers are in the 100s of thousand per year, maybe low millions. I don't know if there is enough lithium and copper in the world to ramp-up production to nearly 100 million of units per year.

Tesla are the only company making high numbers, but even their numbers are less than half of what's needed to be in the top 20 manufacturers.

They are 43rd in this 2017 list, but are around 400,000 units per year now...

http://www.oica.net/wp-content/uploads/World-Ranking-of-Manufacturers-1.pdf
 

Toby

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I did hear the other year too about copper potentially being a problem. We're all going to need cables for charging and installing charging systems, plus all the numerous ones needed publicly, globally. I'm not so sure everyone who now owns a car will be able to own an EV.

I'd agree with Pingu about battery costs and economies of scale - manufacturers wont invest big time until the demand is there, the demand isnt there until the price drops - circular problem. Hence why Gov's are trying to force them in.
However they'll create their own problems with electric generation/usage and loss of revenue from fuel. We've already seen a shift in the RFL, expect more other policies to kick in at some point.
 

california123

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Even when prices moderate for electric cars i will stick with an engine the more cylinders as i can afford .Well thats my two seater,my 5 seat car i dont mind being a mild hybrid but no more,and as long as its a self charging one.Part of the joy of driving is the sound of the engine, and rowing through the gears.Electric cars would in my opinion be boring an d bland.Oh for the sound of v6, v8 ,and v12s
 

Murray Wall

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Copper, nickel, cadmium for the battery.

Cobalt and other rare earth metals for the magnets in the motors.

All very expensive stuff. Plus the refining processes are very high in pollutants, so there is the cost of disposal.
 

Toby

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Copper, nickel, cadmium for the battery.

Cobalt and other rare earth metals for the magnets in the motors.

All very expensive stuff. Plus the refining processes are very high in pollutants, so there is the cost of disposal.
Not forgetting the environmental damage done just extracting the minerals - these tend to just get 'forgotten' along with the tribes it affects.
 

Jasn

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I think the future of cars does not involve everyone owning a car. Companies like Uber are trying to make it more attractive to just buy a ride when you need one without the hassle of insurance, servicing, garaging, repairs and so on. If you have expensive and often quite boring cars, including ones that take over much of the driving, the attraction of owning one goes away. It's not very appealing to folks like us, but I think that's where the industry's future may lie...almost certainly not two or three privately owned cars per household. Could be completely wrong of course.
 

RickyBobby

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Been down the hybrid route before and wouldn't go there again and equally could never imagine not having a car and relying on some kind of 3rd party taxi service.
For me the Tesla / Z3 combo is ideal - having sold the Z4MC the Tesla more than compensates in the speed department and is an ideal every day run about with some interesting smart tech.
For everything else and a proper driving experience the Z3 fits the bill perfectly and if the weather plays ball I can even take the lid off - bonus.
 

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Shawry

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I use an EV for daily commute - its a company car and cost effective for what I do. Do I enjoy driving it ? - no way!!!! boring, bland, horrible. Ive driven Tesla and they are exciting initially but once the silent acceleration has run its course are just another car. I cant wait for weekends when I either jump into my Z4 or my 33 year old dirty smelly diesel Land Rover - however my conscious is clear!!!!
 

california123

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I appreciate Shawrys honesty on electric cars.Driving cars is one of lifes joys mostly.To dilute that joy with bland electric cars is a step back for people who enjoy( real) cars.They ruined f1 races with the weedy v6 and battery hybrid nonsence.Its supposed to be an entertaining sport,but it has become as dull as dishwater.The days of the v12s screaming around the tracks where real f1 cars.cars are not all just a to b transport they can be like the z 4 ect be a joy to own, and drive.They are even talking about some supercars being all electric,yuk.Gordon murray to his credit is bringing out a v12 supercar against all this electric nonsence,well done Gordon.ps sorry to anyone who has an electric car no offence meant,just my opinion. ps i just thought of something horrible ,imagine a 2022 z4 all electric car,it will probably happen,no exaust sound at all, no engine sound at all ,what a joy that would be!!!!!!!!!
 
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Pingu

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99% (*) of cars are driven by people who just want to get from A to B. An IC-engined vehicle is 75% useless at best when moving and 100% useless when it isn't.

Keeping IC engines in vehicles to put a smile on 1% of driver's faces would be madness.

It will be like horses at the beginning of the 20th Century. Those who want to keep their beloved horse can do so, but will pay for the privilege. The rest can just change over to the better mode of getting from A to B.

(*) 93.7% of statistics are made up ;)
 

california123

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I new a guy with a tesler s.I was in side it, and was underwhelmed by the interior.His car was black, and black interior,not a colour combi to my taste.The leather seats where rock hard,the cabin was spartan, and boring.The over large info tainment screen looked stupid in my opinion, it dominates the whole car interior.This tesler was supposed to be a luxury car,it was far from luxurious.Full electric,not impressed.Give me the luxury of a merc s type with a 5 litre engine, an d then you can call it luxury.Elon musk is raking in the money for these boring cars.Once again this is my honest opinion, and i hope i havent annoyed any electric car owners.
 

Jasn

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When I learned to drive, 1991, everyone else leaving school at the same time learned as well. There were maybe a couple of exceptions. Today in Australia, fully one-third of people under 25 don't learn to drive. For a lot that do, it's just a necessity; there's no passion involved. The car's role in society and its importance to individuals is changing a lot.
 

Pingu

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I new a guy with a tesler s.I was in side it, and was underwhelmed by the interior.His car was black, and black interior,not a colour combi to my taste.The leather seats where rock hard,the cabin was spartan, and boring.The over large info tainment screen looked stupid in my opinion, it dominates the whole car interior.This tesler was supposed to be a luxury car,it was far from luxurious.Full electric,not impressed.Give me the luxury of a merc s type with a 5 litre engine, an d then you can call it luxury.Elon musk is raking in the money for these boring cars.Once again this is my honest opinion, and i hope i havent annoyed any electric car owners.
I think you are mixing apples and pears.

The quality of the leather has nothing to do with what powers the wheels.

I don't disagree about losing the "soul" of the car, but I'm sure there were many tears shed when Dobbin had to be turned into glue when father bought a Model T.
 

california123

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Also the car companies are saving on servicing ,no engines to service ,no oil change no nothing,virtually.I think the car companies are laughing all the way to the bank,and with all these savings they are charging more to buy these( pretend cars)brass neck.Im due a new saloon car next year, and it will definately have a proper engine,as i said i might go mild hybrid self charging but thats it.In terms of a sports car mine will always have an engine at least a 6 or 8 cylinder.ps i wonder how many people have been killed worldwide with these virtually silent battery cars creeping up on them,they are an obvious danger on the roads?ps remember the tesler 2 seat roadster battery powered( toy)very like the lotus elise, but no heart and soul.
 

california123

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Great news that maserati are finally making a 2 seater supercar.It looks stunning, but they are going to make a full electric version yuk.They will do a proper car also with a v8 twin turbo with the howl that all supercars should have,not the meek sound of a battery car.I cant imagine why anyone would buy a super car with battery power, and give up the sound of the v8.The sound of a super car is a main part of the joy of these cars.
 

Pingu

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Can I just say that the nicest sounding car I've ever heard was my Metro when the exhaust snapped in front of the centre box.

I could drive it quietly(ish) around town, but it was like rolling thunder under bridges and through the Clyde Tunnel :racecar:
 
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